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Thursday, November 20, 2008
Ya'll are gonna have to be patient with me because I'm still trying to take this one in. This is what we're up against as LGBT people of color in the black community. This is the kind of sick biblical hatred that has manifested itself in the black church that caused the overwhelming support for Prop 8.
I can't even begin to debunk all of the lies and theological liberties spoken in this sermon. I have to wonder how many gay and lesbian folks sat and listened to this and never said a mumbling word.
A few quotes from Rev. Todd Hall of Shabach Christian Church in Orlando, Florida.
"We don't know where homos came from, we don't know where lesbians came from. Some of ya'll are laughing cause you're hiding what you are-but I'm about to bust ya'll up! You cannot have the holy ghost and be a sissy!"
"You've got to preach fear, you just can't preach for money and faith".
Even if I was a sissy, if you were legally telling me I wouldn't go to hell for having Halle(Berry) and Jada(Pinkett-Smith)...at that time I was just a "man" for a day. If you can turn down something that fine and that fresh then you have a demon".
To be continued...
21 Comments:
WOW...
This so unfortunate...
I love when the oppressed become the oppressors.
I'm 22 years old and I'm already tired of fighting, but it doesn't mean I'll stop.
This only makes me want to work harder.
November 20, 2008 4:27 PM
That's THE reason right there why I'm not involved in organized religion, "Willful ignorance," if I can use your term. And that was in California, where you can go to a library, pick up a book and read about research on sexuality and psychology. It's insane.
November 20, 2008 5:24 PM
Is this typical of what goes for preaching in black churches today? A preacher calling gay men "sissies" and what not. How can any black gay man or woman sit in a church and listen to that?
I don't know what goes on in black churches today because I stopped going when I was a teenager and that was a LONG time ago. This lets me know that I made the right decision.
November 20, 2008 7:27 PM
Absolutely ridiculous! I could MAYBE see this kind of talk happening in a barbershop, but in a house of worship?! SHAMEFUL! I too don't have much to say yet...that was a mess...
I will say one thing...I damn near FELL OUT when he offered up Jada Pinkett Smith as one of the female objects of affection...clearly ol' Rev is not up on Jada's "same sex" tendencies LOL.
November 20, 2008 7:45 PM
"You have to preach fear."
Yes that's right preach fear and ignorance so you and flock can feel superior to those evil homosexuals.
They'll give anyone a theology degree these days.
November 21, 2008 1:07 AM
This video made me sick to my stomach because of all the religious rhetoric covered up in hatred. It is so disturbing to see people praise the condemnation of someone else in Christ's name.
I was left dumbfounded at the comment that if any man could turn down the opportunity to sleep with both Jada Pinkett-Smith and Halle Berry to rid himself of homosexuality that person is a true "sissy". This comment alone reduces women to sexual objects who are only worthy of fulfilling a man's sexual desires.
People when are we going to wake up and stop judging one another; God said, "Judge Not Lest Ye Be Judged." I am sure the homosexuals that attend church every Sunday are not quick to judge the most self-proclaimed righteous Christians as they watch these individuals stuff their face at various church functions where food is plentiful; it would be judgmental for the homosexual to say "Gluttony” is a sin so said the Lord, but nothing short of the truth!!!!!
November 21, 2008 3:23 AM
Sorry Darian, but I laughed as soon as I read the quote 'We don't know where homos come from..'. I just couldn't be angry. I simply could not believe the ridiculousness (is that even a word?) and plain stupidity of that statement. And this coming from someone who is suppossed to guide us with his wisdom.
November 21, 2008 4:44 AM
darian,
as a member of a church organization that has had "profit" todd hall speak on many an occassion, i know him to be like so many others who have given themselves these titles -- FAKE. many churck folk confuse the gift of prophecy for discernment; i don't think todd has much of either. i saw this little diddy of his over at DL's blog (blah blah blah), and it was a strain to listen to it all. trust me when i say -- if your spirit is right with God, you will be able to tell what is fluff and what is not coming from the pulpit. and this definitely is fluff...just a bunch of stuff to tickle the peoples' ear so they will drop a few extra dollars in the offering plate.
November 21, 2008 6:50 AM
I am all for individual rights, after all, God gave us all free will and choice.
However, as a gay man, to a certain degree, I feel the church must be holy and sanctified for the work of the Kingdom of God. Regardless of sexual orientation, any sin we do, homosexual or heterosexual is unacceptable to God. I feel that my lifestyle is not what God will's for my life, but I have accepted my choice. However, I have much fear and reverence for God NOT to force my choices into the Church.
The church must taken seriously. We all have done sin and came short in our lives one way or another. However, I have to agree with the Pastor. You just cannot allow anything to come in the church and accept it as "OK". God loves me, as a homosexual man, but I feel homosexuality is wrong in the sight of God in my own self.
November 21, 2008 7:52 PM
@anon 7:52: How can you feel that God loves you as a gay man but also think that God hates homosexuality? How can God both love and hate what you are?
November 23, 2008 5:13 PM
<$BlogCommentAuthor$> said...
@anon 7:52: How can you feel that God loves you as a gay man but also think that God hates homosexuality? How can God both love and hate what you are?>
Not only WHAT you are, but how God made you!? I still puzzle as to how we can see all the amazing beauty and wonder in the world that God has made and yet be so quick to say that when it comes to sex their can be only one thing. Especially when you look at nature and see that their are multiple examples of multiple ways of not only reproducing, but coupling and building family units. Wake up! That Pastor was ridiculous, if I was in that church Jesus himself would've had to come hold ME back. I'll show him his "SISSY"!!
November 23, 2008 9:10 PM
Niggas and church... Too funny. I just wrote a rather scathing post about how black people are very quick to defend the actions of the church, no matter how reprehensible they are.
Todd Hall is a charlatan and the people who follow him are just as tupid as those who follow Juanit Bynum, Thomas Weeks, Rverend Ike, Jamal Harrison Bryant, etc.
The fact of the matter is that i bet his churchis FILLED TO THE BRIM with gay men and women, especially if they happen to have a decent choir. But Todd Hall? This is the same man who fathered a bastard child with Reverend Richard "Mr. Clean" White and was run out of GA. He's the same man who fancies himself as a prophet and had people signing over their property to him as a "seed offering" for God.
I can't be offended by him because I just don't believe that Christianity is a religion for black people. My quarrel is with the mind-numbingly stupid black folks who fill his church and allow him to promulgate bullshit.
Less than 24% of what he preaches comes from the Bible. The rest is just a bunch of screaming, hermeneutics, homiletics, prosperity doctrine, and emotionalism.
Thanks for the post Darian.
November 24, 2008 5:05 PM
One more thing,
In my experiences, though anecdotal, I have found that the most vitriolic and vocal homophobes are typically those with perverted souls. Todd Hall is probably masking some deeep seated, latent homosexual tendecies, if he hasn't acted on them already.
He probably likes to be humiliated during sex. LOL.
November 24, 2008 5:08 PM
BLKSeaGoat: "This is the same man who fathered a bastard child with Reverend Richard "Mr. Clean" White and was run out of GA."
Did Todd Hall REALLY father a child with ANOTHER MAN?
November 24, 2008 9:16 PM
Mr. Cleans' daughter.
November 25, 2008 8:04 AM
BLKSeaGoat:
your comments about religion (here as well as on your blog) always amuse me because they tend to be quite nasty. before you say it, please don't give me "the church is nasty to gays" argument because: 1) i'm not saying the church is right and 2) two wrongs don't make a right.
pertaining to your comments on this post, i think it unfair to call the people who follow these "preachers" stupid (your generalization of such). truth be told, some of them are babes in Christ and are very easily influenced by the hoop and holler. shoot, many of us were influenced by that, but then we woke up. do some of the people who follow these men and women know better -- sure. but honestly, some of them don't. it's one of those situations of "you don't know what you don't know;" i find it hard to believe that God holds things against you for which you have no knowledge. it is when you receive the Light, where accountability really begins. so no...all these people aren't stupid, but merely misguided and i pray that they wake up before it's too late.
November 25, 2008 10:55 AM
Selene,
You're an apologist. The sheepish black folks who continue to define their lives by being linked to a corrupted church are STUPID. If they aren't stupid, then they are severely mentally ill. In the case of the latter, they have episodes of lucidity. In the case of the former, they simply choose religion to remove personal accountability.
The Black Church, post-Civil Rights Era, is a substantial impediment to the progress of black people.
I'm not redacting my comments or changing my position. Leave the plantation mindset back in the past and on the plantation.
Having faith in God should not abrogate one from exercising good judgement. The black folks who sit under preachers like Todd,Eddie, Creflo, Juanita, Tommy Weeks, etc. get no pass.
If you think my commentary is caustic now, wait until I'm finished with a post that I'm writing call "The Nigga Church".
November 26, 2008 2:55 PM
Selene,
Why are you still a member of a church organization that frequently uses that bigot as a speaker?
Have you made your disdain for him known to your organization? Why be a part of something you admit is populated by tons of fake people?
Is God into keeping up appearances and putting on aires?
November 26, 2008 2:58 PM
BLKSeaGoat:
because i perceive the same undertone in your two latest comments, i won't spend too much time humoring you in response.
i will say this much though...call me stupid, an apologist or "plantation patty", but i find your blanket statements about those with a belief system that you do not adhere to unproductive. it's interesting to read that you have so much knowledge about church such that you can say that people are stupid or mentally ill. clearly you are only concerned with letting your feelings be known versus opening the possibility of dialogue. your "stupid" and "mentally ill" references only further place a wedge between people.
but that's what you choose to believe; do you. i'm sure you think your statements come across as passionate, but they also come across in a divisive way. it's unfortunate that your experiences with religion, church, or COGIC (which seems to be a frequent "religious" topic of yours) have caused you to arrive at these conclusions. but i choose to believe that there are STILL some sincere people in church. and i also believe that i am not so indoctrinated that my mind is closed off to other possibilities from a spiritual sense.
and because you don't know me, it doesn't really make any point in saying what objections that i have voiced because ultimately, you still believe me to be stupid, right?
feel free to have the last word...i'm sure you would like to reiterate just how wrong you believe me to be :-/
November 26, 2008 8:11 PM
Wow, Darian. This has to be the most virulent hatefulness that I've heard coming from across a pulpit in a very long time. Perhaps Ever! I watched the video, signed off and out, and had to come back again. What I saw and heard would not leave me alone. One question is ringing through my soul right now. The same question that many of us have asked a million times - to others and often to ourselves i.e. WHY DO WE CONTINUE TO SIT THERE AND PAY OUR TITHES FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO BE USED, ABUSED AND BASHED IN THESE CHURCHES? This preacher of hate, this Todd Hall, answered the question in one fell swoop of a sentence "You've got to preach fear". And one of your other readers - the anonymous young gay man in the church - co-signed it with his comments of confusion and FEAR! I thank you for posting the video, but I swear it was eleven minutes of disheartenment that is threatening to settle permanently in my spirit. On one hand, nothing is unsurmountable with God on our side, but I am not sure that I will live to see the day that this type of vileness can be overcome in the BLACK church. And speaking of God, when are we as black LGBT folk going to DARE to believe God can actually BE ON OUR SIDE? When are we going to do our own independent bible study to see where we stand instead of accepting soul-killing lies and fables from Rev. Chickenleg? When are we going to KNOW and TRY God for ourselves? When we will take our gifts, tithes, offerings and uniqueness and pack to the rafters the many affirming churches that await us? Oh...........FEAR! Confusion! Disbelief! And God is not the author of NONE of it ! !
December 01, 2008 1:22 AM
I was bracing myself for what I was planning on hearing before I clicked on the video. The black church sometimes kills me. Of course this minister does not represent what Christianity beliefs are based on. We know he is ignorant just like the rest of the fools who have been brainwashed into condemning their own people because "religion" says so...or in their case the "bible." His arrogance will send him to hell quicker than anything else as well as the name-bashing. He signing his own sentence while he trying to denounce other people. He think he covered by the blood. He just covered in ignorance and homophobia.
January 12, 2009 4:54 PM
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